Ask Lemmy

Sounds like attitude of wage slaves that have been brainwashed into doing everything for the corpos and being fine with getting scrap. They live to work as opposed to work to live.

Can't change the slave mentality of some people. They were just born to be one.

Americans are weird.

Honestly the time with your partner and kid is precious irreplaceable.

Anyone who's weird about it is insecure about their own paternal involvement.

Paternity leave is a no brainer for families of all stripes. Both spouses should have time off to care for their children in the first year of their life, especially during the vulnerable first year before they are immunized against dangerous diseases. And I'm in a same sex relationship, so I'm definitely using it when we are ready to have kids, haha.

Honestly, each parent should have 6 mo of paid leave.

Edit: adding onto this, all men's bathrooms should have changing stations. It's insane that some women's do, but men's do not.

Your coworkers are fucking idiots.

Most men are hard working and want to support their families

... which is exactly why you should take paternity leave and support your family, instead of abandoning them for 8 hours a day at work. I'd feel like a total asshole if I just took off and said, "Good luck with the baby, honey. I'm gonna go hang out with my friends at work."

I went through the same thing when I took my paternity leave. Other male coworkers bragged about how they went back to work the day after their kid was born.

It's a culture thing where our society is conditioned to be boot lickers for the ruling class. I responded to them at the time, "Congratulations on being a bad father, I'm going to take every day entitled to me"

Don't fall into their trap.

Its amazing. Especially if you take it when mom goes back to work. That's your time to figure out how to be a parent. Not what works for mom or grandparents. Your thing between dad and baby. I figured out I had to take walks around the block to get baby to nap. I think of that sometimes now when she's big. Also: if they give you shit: say - "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to spend more time with your kids."

You are surrounded with workaholic, misogynists. My company gives full pay for 12 weeks for mothers and fathers. Several of my coworkers, mostly men, have used their leave in full (usually 9 weeks together and the other 3 broken up). Nobody ever looks down on people for taking leave.

Maybe they would take all of it if it was for full pay. Ya'll motherfuckers need a union.

Honestly it took me years to lose the American work mindset. It was destroying my brain.

Take the leave and feel no shame. Others are reacting because you taking leave challenges their understanding of work. Something that is exceedingly rare in the US.

People are idiots. Why would you give up a benefit you're legally entitled to? Nobody is going to as much as thank you for that.

Swede here. Taking care of your family means being an active parent and a sharing partner.

I took 18 months paternity leave with our firstborn so my partner could finish their degree.

What moron would pass up on 85% paid leave??

What you're missing is full brainwashing from the patriarchy, from the bootlicking capitalists.

Any partner who can but doesn't support their partner and newborn is an ass.

Any partner who can but doesn't take advantage of the leave benefit they earned is giving free money to their employer overlords like an absolute cuck.

Be revolutionary, put your family over your employer.

Do it. Be with your offspring as much as you can. Anything else is barbaric corporate slave mentality.

In our country, both parents are allowed to spend 6 months (each) at home with the newborn.

The traditional view that the father needs to work is strong. In Denmark we have had the opportunity to share the maternity/paternity leave between parents for several years, but most often the mother would take the majority, with only 2 weeks being specific for the father.

This is due to the imbalance in pay, since the cut in pay would be larger for a man (generally), so men voluntarily gave the leave to their wives. This is obviously not the intention of the leave and also based on the flaw of unequal pay. Keep in mind that the wage difference is often explained as being caused by the mother taking more leave and thereby not advancing her career during the years when they have small children.

So, to fix his, the latest law make more weeks untransferable. The father now has 11 weeks that can not be transferred. Use it or lose it.

One would expect such a removal of flexibility to make people upset, because technically it will cost the families more potential income, but it hasn't.

It turns out that most men actually wanted the additional weeks of paternity leave. They just needed it to be normalized and/or the legal framework to demand it, so they don't have to have this discussion with their employers or wives. No man is ever asked why they're taking it now. Use it or lose it makes sense to everyone.

In addition we still have 26 (13+13) weeks that can be transferred however the parents want. Still very flexible.

Don't listen to those morons. Paternity leave is a legit great way to stay with your wife and children when they need it the most.

That group you overheard were reinforcing their excuses for ignoring the needs of their child along with the needs of the mom, and reinforcing beliefs that have overwhelming evidence of being false.

Kids needs dads in their lives, the earlier the better. Moms need dads to help out and support them.

You're not taking time off work to laze about, you're switching from one job to take on several related jobs for a while so that you,your child, and your woman have a brighter future than any amount of money could buy.

You're only missing out on taking the easy, shortsighted route. You're missing out on ignoring the future cost your family has to pay in or for you to get back to the familiar routine of work as soon as possible. You're missing out on staying with the known game of work to avoid taking on something new.

You're not missing out, they are.

Fuuuuck that. There's a reason it's offered. You get once in your life to see your newborns like that. Fuck your coworkers, take the time.

And this is coming from someone who is child free and really doesn't enjoy kids personally. Take the time, be with your family. Jobs come and go but your family is who matters. Start talking the other way. "I want to make sure I absorb this while I can, I can't imagine missing these moments" and "this will only happen once or twice in my life, how could I miss that?".

So basically, the choice is to spend 12 weeks with those idiots or with your baby? Seems like a no brainer to me.

It's just hyperbolic masculine capitalism being parroted. Live in the U.S. south and have dealt with many friends and their relatives who have said the same shit. I've been around long enough to see those same people completely fall apart when the lives at home just crumble because they're too busy with work (illness, deaths in family, etc). They always eventually come to regret the decisions and times they've missed once they get in their later years.

There's nothing wrong with choosing to prioritize a work career in one's life though, but hating on someone else's choice is just ridiculous.

The "work yourself to death" is a stupid boomer concept. It's a hugely negative aspect of traditional masculinity.

When people say weird stuff like this, I always question why. Why would you have a kid and then work so hard to be away from it? Why would you work for a company that will lay you off the moment it earns them a higher stock price to do so? (no modern company deserves your loyalty.) Why would you brag about suffering instead of relaxing?

I understand that we're all wired differently but those values literally don't make sense to me.

You’re the smart one. Fuck the haters. Ignore them.

heard stuff like “Most men are hard working and want to support their families so they don’t take leave”

Very cringe and capitalist boot-licking mindset

Let me introduce you to a new concept: 躺平

Chinese people are actually so based and is already resisting their State-Capitalist CCP tyranny

We should learn a thing or two

😎

To me it was a no brainer, I’m getting ~85% of my normal pay

You get paid?

OF COURSE FUCKING TAKE IT. I'd even take it unpaid, GETTING PAID IS LIKE A CHERRY ON TOP. TAKE IT 😎

I've just lost someone in my team for 4 months due to paternity leave. As far as I'm aware on full pay too.

I'm happy he gets to take it, you guys in the US have it rough with workers rights. I'd say take the maximum you can and enjoy the time, we're not put on this earth to generate profit.

Be the change you want to see and make sure you brag to everyone about how great it is when you get back, maybe they'll start to think differently.

Pretty sure THEY are the ones missing something. They've been brainwashed into thinking you should be embarrassed NOT to shun your family so you can be at work 24/7 to make someone else rich. Take advantage of that program while it still exists.

People always bitch about fathers being too busy for their kids and shit but as soon as a father wants to be there they're all like "ew what the fuck is wrong with him"

12 weeks paternity leave at 85% salary? Damn, that's sweet, even by many EU standards.

I wouldn't think twice about taking it.

That is an absolute no-brainer. Pay aside, take care of family.

That's the whole purpose of the pay anyhow, money is just an odd totem that we allow to take care of our families.

Plus, you get to hang out with the little one for 3 months! Your wife loves you even better. It's wins all the way down.

Oregon has this and it was amazing to take 12 weeks of paternity. We can also split it up, so I did part time for like 30 weeks. Kept us from needing to find childcare until she was almost 1.

Fuck your coworkers opinions. Even the 12 weeks I got is nothing compared to my Norwegian coworkers.

My main thought on paternity leave is that it should be exactly the same as the maternity leave so that there is no difference between hiring a man or a woman.

Come to the EU, noone will scoff at paternity leave here. On the contrary, colleagues will congratulate you for procreating lol

I'm pretty sure there is enough research that supports the idea of paternity leave increasing parental involvement and connection with your child and leading to more gender equality/more balanced responsibilities in families.

My husband and I went the very conservative route with him being off for 2 months and me being off for 3 years (German classic). Let me tell you I would have not survived the newborn stage, having no help from outside, without him. At the same time, for him it was so hard - although I am not sure that work was easier, he after all still came home to a little baby. Parental leave doesn't mean you get to chill, it means you have no excuse for not doing half of the night shift, half of everything except breast feeding. When he went back to work, he would do the night shifts on the weekends, and I would do all the night shifts on workdays.

Your co-workers are morons. They miss out on helping their baby mamas, connecting with their kids, and going through a unique experience. Even if your pay was much lower, it's worth it. It's hard and stressful and awful and it is the best thing you'll ever do.

It sounds like your fellow wagies have been conditioned to shun anything that smells even a little "socialist". Paternity leave not only smells like communism, but also wokeism by daring to suggest that the man of the house should maybe share the responsibility of taking care of their baby.

You are bravely doing the radical feminist work of daring to care for your wife who is likely going to have trouble with either holding her bladder (if she squeezed your new family member out through her pelvis) or with standing up and holding your baby (if she got a c-section). How do you feel knowing most of your coworkers wouldn't do this for their wife?

In the U.S. we're taught to brag about how much we're exploited, as if it's a virtue.

It's a very sick culture.

Those guys are going to be “blindsided” by divorce because they’re such “nice guys”….all of the other dudes they constantly spend all of their time trying to impress tell them so

Men who brag how little time they spend with their kids shouldn’t be having kids.

Both parents should be entitled to take 12 months leave as a minimum, and their employer should be required to pay their salary and protect their position during that time.

Work is something I do, not who I am.

Americans have been indoctrinated to feel their work is their worth.

I WISH my husband had been able to take time off. Those first few weeks of sleep deprivation are fucking ROUGH on your own. I think you did the right thing and that the child is going to get dramatically better care because his parents are actually sonewhat rested.

Any man that thinks work is more important than spending time with the family is a bad father. I say this as the son of a bad father.

Absolutely take paternity. Why wouldn't you?

It is a no brainer dude. Absolutely take the leave. You know how the work culture is here in the US, it's pretty ridiculous. The "Live to Work" crowd is getting pretty old now though so I have seen a shift in corporate culture where I am at.

I support paternity leave and would like to see it normalized.

I feel like I’m missing something.

No, they are lol. Wth is wrong with them?

I have four kids and I took ~6 weeks of paternity leave for each of them (which was in my contract—I’m an Episcopal priest, though I still went in on Sundays because I was going to go to church regardless so I might as well lead services and save the parish money on paying what we call a “supply priest”). It’s absolutely worth it and don’t let anyone make you feel weird about it. You’re doing a great thing for your partner and child—as well as yourself. Babies are a lot of work for dads as well! Acting like dads don’t need paternity leave is a form of patriarchy.

Most democratic countries have a full 12 months leave or more for whichever parent ( or shared between both.) Maybe this lack of early bonding and co-regulation between family members explains US as it is today.