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From Wikipedia:
"A concentration camp is a prison or other facility used for the internment of political prisoners or politically targeted demographics, such as members of national or minority ethnic groups, on the grounds of state security, or for exploitation or punishment."
I'd say it tracks.
It is not new though, it started with Guantanamo concentration camp for Taliban fighters.
It is not new though, it started with Guantanamo concentration camp for Taliban fighters.
It is not new though, it started with 10 concentrations camps during World War 2 for Japanese Americans.
It is not new though, it started with Guantanamo concentration camp for Taliban fighters.
It is not new though, it started with 10 concentrations camps during World War 2 for Japanese Americans.
It is not new though, it started with concentration camps for the extermination and removal of the Native Americans
Hey! You skipped the civil war concentration camps on both sides, how dare you.
I've always thought it was hypocritical of Americans to be calling Nazis the worst. We literally enslaved a group of people for hundreds of years, bred and slaughtered them at our whim. Had concentration camps, and more. We're not better, and probably worse. We just had good propaganda.
In Die Hard, when Hans is describing Takagi, he says "interned at Manzanar 1942-43". 9 year old imsufferableninja thought he was talking about an internship at a prestigious company called Manzanar. 25 year old imsufferableninja finally figured it out. They did not teach about the US's concentration camps at my schools, for some reason...
The stated purpose of CECOT is to put people in violently cramped, close confinement with each other until they die.
It is a deathcamp.
They're right that we should at minimum not allow them to define how we talk about this, and we should call it what it is.
But we should also have a plan to avoid getting put in a concentration camp when we do so. Stay safe, and be good everyone.
America has been doing this for decades. Look at Guantanamo Bay. We used the excuse of terrorism then and now we're using the excuse of boarder security. As long as people can be controlled by their greed ~~of~~ or fear then this will continue to happen.
Edit: autocorrect...
Also look at FDRs concentration camps for Japanese Americans. This shit is a time honored tradition in this country.
I don't want to minimize the suffering of Japanese Americans in the camps in any way, but from the history I've read they seem to be a few steps up from whatever the hell is going on at CECOT.
greed
fear
And especially disgust. They weaponize it so much.
By the way, only some concentrations camps in Nazi Germany were exterminations camps. So even without any mass murder this can easily be regarded as equivalent in function to a concentration camp.
Specifically, extermination camps are industrialized human suffering. Something like an assembly line that builds cars, except the output is death.
All that said, splitting hairs about the definition of this stuff is not a good place to be.
We invented concentration camps in the US to deal with Chinese and Native American "undesirables," back in the mid 1800s. This is just the third time, at least, we have started using them. We only pretend to be better than the Nazis because we didn't have the idea to use them as mass murder camps, just slow death camps.
America already had concentration camps in the form of ICE detention camps and prisons. The trials most faced before being sent to prison do not some how make those prisons not concentration camps. Those also have inhumane living conditions, forced labor, dehumanization, brutal violence, isolation from accountability, psychological torture and murder.
El Salvador is certainly worse, but we didn't get here overnight. The american people have been conditioned to accept this over decades by sending millions of people to internal slave labor camps with the thin excuse of "but they had due process!!!1!"
How is this all going so fast, tho? Didn't it take the nazis a few years to get to this point?
Nazis got to all the points they wanted so lightning-fast that nothing happening now can rival it.
That's one of the reasons for the cultural shock about Nazis - everybody expected such processes to happen very slowly, in small flashes, as they do now. Thus them to be voted out or pressed out as a reaction, or at least for most potential victims to flee Germany, gradual pressure, compromise, all that.
Instead they came to power, almost momentarily changed the internal balance of power (of armed forces, their own paramilitary organizations, veteran organizations and such), anschlussed Austria, "solved unemployment" (organized massive programs of building autobahns and such, not very economically viable, but a symbol and a working mechanism), attracted investments (various scams on enormous scale, but the funds were attracted and it wasn't all scams), scaled the military back to something realistic, performed successful rearmament programs ... And built concentration camps. They started with something like Guantanamo almost immediately after coming to power, then didn't lose any time to learn.
See, they had an apparatus, even a social layer of very well educated people, but with indoctrination of service and obedience, and the legacy of German science and industry and patriotism too. They broke that, but not before successfully using it for a lot of things.
That's the problem with building good systems, they prevent idiots from learning who they are earlier. It's the same with Sun and DEC and other legacy in tech. Everybody still uses their paradigms and products descended from theirs. Vision, architecture, aesthetic (only hidden somewhere deep). So everybody big has now IMHO wrong ideas about how to solve problems, but since everybody also uses solutions made by those who had right ideas 30-15 years ago, they don't get the feedback. Today's tech is a pile of crap reinforced with yesteryear grass, but it doesn't fall apart in your hands because for the main problems you use solutions from a more civilized age.
The Nazis didn't have the historical context of the Nazis' rise to power to help guide them.
ICE detention centers in the USA count as concentration camps as do American Indian reservations, too, but yes we now have our own concentration camps out-of-country like the CIA black sites for illegal rendition or the NAZIs in Poland, Czechoslovakia, and Belarus and the "secure hamlet" programs carried out by our Vietnam vets, for examples.
One thing I noted is that the majority of the people that got deported had tattoos.
Are they intentionally seeking people like that?
yes, they are explicitly going after people with tattoos https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/ice-list-venezuelan-immigrants-gang-members-1235306641/
This facility, built under President Nayib Bukele’s “war on gangs,” houses over 40,000 men, most of whom were arrested en masse without any process resembling justice—just tattoos, zip codes, or looking nervous.
Not just American deportees...
Look at the shade of their head. These people had hair. Without hair its easy to think they are typical American gang members with shaved heads. But look at the tan-less skin. They had hair and they were shaved to prevent lice but also to remove their personality. Look at some with glasses. Gang members often hate people with glasses because those people often have more money to pay for glasses.
I suggest making some reforms to state institutions before someone else gains control of at least two thirds of the political power. Having support from two thirds of a legislative body is sufficient to completely rewrite a constitution in many cases, so the only question is whether a "supermajority" can reach some consensus.
I personally don't have a lot of hope for peaceful reform, given what I see from https://ballotpedia.org/Results_for_ranked-choice_voting_(RCV)_and_electoral_system_ballot_measures,_2024
I'm sure Republicans would say the same and more about me, but I'd take one migrant who took a risk to work harder than almost any Americans do and give their children a better life (funny how they actually do what the American mythos claims to value, they walk the walk of our largely bullshit rhetoric), at our big corpo's invitation no less, than a hundred of my fellow American supposed conservatives born in the developed world acting like they hit a triple and reveling in the suffering of those who weren't born in what was once a cradle of safety until they demolished it with their ballot, seeking to destroy their enemies, aka most Americans, in the zero sum game Faux News drilled into their head.
These people are unashamedly drunk on the schaudenfreude of cruelty. To me, their willful rejection of basic human empathy means they are wholly devoid of value.
Even if you were a massive shithead racist, and only wanted white Americans working in America, it doesn't matter. Even if you were to somehow convince white, natural born Americans to work the shitty farm, housekeeping, and industrial cleaning jobs, it doesn't matter.
There simply aren't enough white, natural born Americans to fulfill all of those jobs. Our economy will fucking collapse without migrant labor. Our food supply will collapse. We depend on a lot of people working really awful jobs for peanuts to have food on the table every day. There is no amount of rhetoric that will change that. And if it takes the collapse of the United States for these motherfuckers to learn that then so be it. I'll see y'all at the pitchforks and torches rally.
This is something people around the world need to understand.
All the developed countries with plummeting birth rates should be actively competing for citizens.
Though for non-US nations they are already getting some help from our self-imposed brain drain.
Home of the not so often brave and land of the less and less free.
Land of the fee,
And the home of the slave
In all literal sense of the phrase: this is a concentration camp
It's a very honest article.
It's hard to know how to respond, however. The problem is religion. And believe it or not, compassion and the existence of trans people is the key that has allowed the psychopathic class to gain power.
Many religious types see empathy as a threat to their religious beliefs, which are all innately fake. All people who are kind and empathetic and understand science want to be kind to people who are trans, and for religious people, this threatens the core of their belief system. In the beginning, the Unicorn Sky Man created Adam and Even, not Adam Eve and THEM. So if some people are intersex, and some people look male but feel female, or look female and feel male, it exposes the lies of their religious myths and suddenly makes the bullshit at the CORE of their cult very clear.
These religious people can't admit their beliefs are based on lies, can't admitted they were tricked into believing bullshit, and so they will cling to ANYTHING that supports their delusional moron cult instead of providing empathy to people who are different.
Suddenly, in come the psychopaths who don't give a fuck about anyone, knowing full well they can exploit this situation for more power and money. And sadly they have taken this large core of religious delusional idiots, which makes up about 65% of the country, and they are appealing directly to them: "We will support your religious delusions by hating trans people + we have some other ideas." And the 65% universally voted for it.
The other ideas are all psychopathic ideas to enrich and empower this psychopathic class, which the 65% don't understand because let's face it they are all idiots who mostly don't understand science which is why they believe in religious bullshit, and now the psychopathic class are trying to use subterfuge and obfuscation to hide the fact that the "other ideas" are going to fuck over everyone in order to consolidate power and wealth.
So previously, most cruel movements stopped because of religion: slavery stopped because white women started feeling the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while being cruel to black people who seemed similar to themselves, with this similarity in part because white men had been raping black women. The Holocaust stopped because there was a disabled president who felt it was immoral to kill people who were different, backed up by a public who believed Jewish people were part of their religious foundation.
So now, it's different: the others are people that the 65% can't relate to with tattoos who are either ethnically different and not linked to their religious beliefs or are trans people who they simply choose to believe are mentally ill because if trans people aren't mentally ill, it means their religion is based on lies. The psychopaths who have come into power innately understand this. I do not believe for one moment that Trump Vance and their ilk at the top really believe all this religious bullshit. They understand it and they use it.
This 65 percent is a dangerous monstrosity that is destroying the country with their stupid religious beliefs. But there's really no winning in this situation. The 65 percent cannot become "woke" because they are idiots. Would you wake up a camel or wake up a pig? Can you enlighten a rat or a turkey? No, these people will always be idiots, they are a dangerous amorphous blob of idiocy and if you try to wake them up they will cling to their bibles, truck nuts, and beer while yelling about trans people.
What is also happening is the world is currently being environmentally destroyed. At the risk of sounding crazy, but who gives a fuck because it's lemmy, we are also dealing with a strange presence that lives in our oceans with advanced technology and flying crafts. They have bases and can alter time, according to some, unless this is all a lie. We don't know why they are there, we don't know if this planet is just being farmed, or if they have always been there, waiting like cicadas to feast on all of us once become plentiful enough during some orgiastic 10000 year feast, and no one fucking discusses this bizarre situation or why they are there. The military claims they don't know. We also do not know if those beings have somehow infiltrated leadership. Our leaders are not tested for loyalty publicly. For all we know, every single major player in the US right now could be compromised. This may not even be a psychopathic class. This may be Russian compromise at best. We simply do not know who in our leaders is loyal because any adversary of the US can see this "hack" is fairly simple: appeal to the delusional bullshit of religious people by hating trans people and you can own the country, because decent politicians aren't idiots and know that intersex people and people with different gender identities exist. But 65% of the country is actually that fucking stupid.
And so this evil happens, with people being sent to a Latino Holocaust, and there's really no way to fight it because they control 65% of the public through a hack. There can be no religious awakening of these morons now because any consciousness, any awareness or decency or empathy means acknowledging trans people and that means acknowledging their religion is a heaping pile of lies, which it's always been.
The psychopathic class, or possibly a controlled class, that has gotten into power also knows the conundrum that decent leaders feel: if you are a decent leader, do you stop fighting for basic normal rights for trans people to try to get some of the 65% back, thereby ensuring some trans people will feel marginalized and literally die as a result through deaths of despair, or do you refuse to morally compromise, ensuring doom? Eventually, more accepting young people are going to start voting, so this problem will eventually go away in 20 years, but the cruelty and exploitation and viciousness is all happening right now. So what can be done right now?
I'm not sure if there's anything that can be done. I don't see a solution. I am not sure organization will do anything, protests will do anything, the math just isn't on the side of decent people. Does anyone think there is a solution to this problem that doesn't involve waiting 20 years?
Bases and altering time?
They've done it before, why would we think they wouldn't do it again?