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I recently saw a very good YouTube video on that topic and how the original studies often failed to account for variables.
Slight tangent, but it's weird how 2 drinks per day is a low limit. If you drink even 1 drink per day regularly that's probably an addiction imo
It is a lot easier to do good statistics now than ever before. It’s really important to make sure studies use good methodology.
I’m personally opposed to a lot of meta studies because older studies tend to bin ages and covariates and there is zero logic or evidence to that except it making things seem simpler on paper.
Modern regression spline techniques and knowing to use f tests correctly actually give us much much more reliable models that better use observed data.
As Frank Harrel calls it, dichotomania (arbitrarily binning real values) is a scourge on science.
I would like to know if, health wise, it’s the same to drink 2 drinks per day or four every second day (excluding the obvious short term effects)
4 every second day has much better effects on my mental health.
I’m a social drinker, so I’m more likely to drink “some” drinks once a week than a little every day. The latter is really not appealing!
Agreed. Also mathematically that's "a couple of beers:"
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Thanks for the chuckle! Considering the health advise is specifically about two beers, saying a couple in context seemed confusing. Thus the quotation marks.
A lot of these studies will ask “In the last X weeks how many drinks have you had” then they normalize that, so I doubt there’s much distinction in the studies.
I guess what I’m saying is the studies typically won’t make a distinction on that.
Which feels like it leaves a lot out of the picture to me.
On an average week, where I don't go to a party, I'm not on vacation, etc. I'm probably averaging out to less than 2 drinks a week.
When I try to factor in those parties and such, even with some pretty generous estimates, I barely average out to 1 drink a day.
Of course when I do have those parties and such, I probably go above that average for that particular day/week.
And I feel like there could be some pretty significant differences between someone who is actually having a beer or two or three almost every day, and someone like me who drinks little or no alcohol for most of the year, but does get a bit drunk at a party a handful of times a year.
Both might be pretty similar in terms of total average alcohol consumption, but the pattern is obviously pretty different.
And I'm not saying that one or the other is necessarily any more or less harmful, but you never really see the data broken down like that and if they're not looking into it with that sort of detail, I feel like that's leaving themselves open to really miss something important.
If we're being literal, yeah it's a bit scary that they need one drink every day.
If we're talking averages across time, 1 drink a day is equivalent to kicking back a 12 pack every other weekend (plus two more drinks). Just sounds like a good time.
To be clear I've had maybe one beer in the last year, and it was handed to me. I don't really have strong personal opinions about drinking in either direction.
You clearly have no history of addiction of you think a single drink a day is addiction.
The definition of addiction is about a persistent and intense urge. The amount necessary to quench that urge is irrelevant.
It's not the same level of addiction as someone who has a handle a day but a small addiction is still an addiction by definition.
Some addictions are just psychological e.g. weed, but things like coffee, nicotine, and alcohol also have physical effects upon quitting.
That’s a non-scientific definition for a medical condition.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/addiction
Dsm5: Taking the substance in larger amounts or for longer than you're meant to
Wanting to cut down or stop using the substance but not managing to
Spending a lot of time getting, using, or recovering from use of the substance
Cravings and urges to use the substance
Not managing to do what you should at work, home, or school because of substance use
Continuing to use, even when it causes problems in relationships
Giving up important social, occupational, or recreational activities because of substance use
Using substances again and again, even when it puts you in danger
Continuing to use, even when you know you have a physical or psychological problem that could have been caused or made worse by the substance
Needing more of the substance to get the effect you want (tolerance)
Development of withdrawal symptoms, which can be relieved by taking more of the substance
Note that the dsm5 categorizations only needs a couple of those for it to count as a mild substance use disorder. A daily habit you can't stop, cravings/urges, and a history of familial problems made worse by it, and withdrawal symptoms are more than enough to count without regard to the amount. I'm addicted to caffeine as are most adults I know. Hell some people can fit this definition with junk food and that counts and is valid.
That's not how addiction works. Firstly, addiction is not a defined term in the medical or psychological fields so the conversation is kind of pointless. Secondly, amount has nothing to do with it. Lots of people have a "nightcap to help them sleep" every night. That is dependence and problematic or colloquially, addiction even if it's only one drink.
That is in fact how addiction works. If you don’t trigger any effects then you do not develop the addictive response. Quantity is absolutely a factor to some degree and a single drink for most adults will not trigger any euphoric effects.
OK and what about for the people who one drink does trigger an effect?
Again, what about for the people who it does? You're being quite absolute here. What I'm saying is you cannot use amount alone to determine whether or not it's problematic. You said it yourself, it's a factor. You originally used it as a determinant.
So no, that is not in fact how addiction works. I've spent the last 10 years studying psychology and I'm a PhD student in the field now.
I have a drink after work most days and have done so for years. It helps me unwind and gets my stress level down to where I can actually relax in the hour or two of free time I have before bed, but I wouldn't say I'm addicted. If I have places to be or things to do or just don't drink one or more days it's not like I'm craving it.
This is me. Maybe 3 days a week, I’ll enjoy a drink (sometimes two if I’m pouring, say, a lighter gin & tonic) before bed. I can stop drinking at any time. And I regularly do, during one of my diet cycles or after getting back from vacation when I wanna take a break from alcohol.