this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2025
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[–] Tinidril@midwest.social -1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

the party went to court for the right to rig.

Not a fair interpretation of an argument made by a single DNC lawyer in a single context. Also, the primary is over and Mamdani won.

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Not a fair interpretation of an argument made by a single DNC lawyer in a single context.

A completely accurate representation, made by a lawyer representing the party and setting precedent they have taken advantage of ever since.

Also, the primary is over and Mamdani won.

I'm not sorry that the party's machinations against the left fail sometimes.

[–] Tinidril@midwest.social 0 points 18 hours ago (2 children)

It's accurate that their lawyer made that true argument. That's just how party primaries work in the US, unfortunately. It's not accurate that "the party went to court for the right to rig". The whole point of the argument was to avoid a potentially long and expensive case from moving forward. The context matters, and the lawyer would have been incompetent not to bring it up, as would a Republican or even Green party lawyer in that situation.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

That's an overly charitable interpretation.

What actually happened was that progressives sued the DNC for unfairly rigging the primaries, which they did.

Rather than try to deny it, they went with the tactic of saying "well we're allowed to because we own the process, not the voters".

This in spite of their own charter mandating that they stay neutral and not favor any candidate over others during the primary process.

[–] Tinidril@midwest.social -1 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

I don't think the word "rigging" tells an accurate story. I do think they pulled strings to get all the establishment candidates to Voltron into Biden for super Tuesday. I do think they influenced their cohorts in the media to make Bernie look like he couldn't win the general. I don't believe they messed with the voting process itself, which is what "rigging" tends to invoke.

Rather than try to deny it, they went with the tactic of saying

Again, context matters. In a legal process there are different times to make different arguments, and a good lawyer makes use every argument available. This particular argument dealt with whether or not the court had jurisdiction in the matter, so it came early in the process.

This in spite of their own charter mandating that they stay neutral

What exactly does that mean? Is every member required to be personally neutral in even their personal relationships outside the DNC? Does that extend to Obama who is neither a board member or on staff at the DNC? Being neutral is a good idea, but that rule is pretty meaningless.

To be clear, I am no apologist for the Democratic establishment. I blame them more for Trump than the Republicans. That's why I want progressives to show up and vote them out in primaries. Giving the false impression that their vote won't count is counterproductive.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 5 hours ago

they pulled strings to get all the establishment candidates to Voltron into Biden for super Tuesday. I do think they influenced their cohorts in the media to make Bernie look like he couldn't win the general

That very much qualifies as rigging.

I don't believe they messed with the voting process itself

How do you know? They control every part of it and have shown that they're not above board in general 🤷

a good lawyer makes use every argument available.

That's not how it works, no. A good lawyer chooses a coherent strategy that's both likely to be successful and in accordance with the wishes of the client.

The DNC itself has a lot of skilled lawyers and would have agreed on a strategy long before a word was said in court. This was their choice, not that of a neutral lawyer just doing his darndest.

Being neutral is a good idea,

Agreed

but that rule is pretty meaningless

Only when it comes to unprincipled hypocrites who don't care about the spirit of the rules but only how they can bend and break them to further their own agenda.

Is every member required to be personally neutral in even their personal relationships

Only to the extent that those relationships affect the primaries. Which they very much do when you're doing everything you can to favor a specific candidate.

Does that extend to Obama who is neither a board member or on staff at the DNC?

He's still a member of the party, one of if not THE most influential and thus powerful one at that, with more weight behind his words than most. That great power comes with great responsibility

To be clear, I am no apologist for the Democratic establishment

Could have fooled me, what with all that apologia 🙄

I blame them more for Trump than the Republicans

On that we agree, at least.

That's why I want progressives to show up and vote them out in primaries

That would be great, if the DNC would ever allow it.

Giving the ~~false~~ accurate impression that ~~their vote won't count~~ they will be manipulated and cheated is ~~counterproductive~~ the first step in the process of making sure that it will.

Fixed that for you.

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 1 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

To be clear, I am no apologist for the Democratic establishment.

To be clear, that's the only thing you have ever been or ever will be.

Giving the false impression that their vote won’t count is counterproductive.

Pointing out that the party does everything it can to ratfuck progressives means that they might respond to pressure to stop, and you don't want that.

[–] Tinidril@midwest.social 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

To be clear, that's the only thing you have ever been or ever will be.

Oh, fuck off. I've been brutal towards the establishment. I just want them beaten, and pretending elections are rigged is counterproductive to that end. You're nothing but a right wing agitator.

they might respond to pressure to stop

Why would they? It's apparently working. Now who is suddenly feeling charitable towards the establishment? You think they can be shamed into playing nice? You are so full of shit.

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

Oh, fuck off. I’ve been brutal towards the establishment.

Yes, you brutally defend them every chance you get no matter what they do.

You think they can be shamed into playing nice?

Yeah, they'll only change by unconditional enthusiastic support every time they betray anyone to your left.

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 0 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

God damn, you're hyperfixating on one part of my initial comment because you don't like people remembering how awful your wing of the party constantly is to anyone but netanyahu and two cheneys.

[–] Tinidril@midwest.social 0 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

You have no fucking idea what wing of the party I belong to.

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

I know you scream "republican" at anyone who says the party should listen to the left for the first fucking time.