this post was submitted on 14 Nov 2025
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Happens way too often๐Ÿ˜ฎโ€๐Ÿ’จ (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 day ago by GrammarPolice@lemmy.world to c/memes@lemmy.world
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[โ€“] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 52 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Mine is the time I tried to convince an anti-abortion person on Facebook that when she claimed some ABSURD number of abortions were taking place that it was not possible. Whatever figure she gave, I took it and did some quick guesstimating math, showing my work, and it led to the conclusion that if her figure was right, around 50% of women on earth who were capable of pregnancy were not only getting pregnant every year, but also were having at least one abortion per year. She was completely undeterred by the fact that she probably was overestimating the number of abortions occurring by like 30 times or probably much more.

That's when I realized that facts are not important to certain people. 30 times overestimated or not, didn't matter. Even one was enough to give the exact same weight to the issue.

[โ€“] Hobo@lemmy.world 29 points 1 day ago (2 children)

You're telling me that the facebook picture that says that liberal blue haired lesbian women get an average of 300 abortion per minute is lying? Well I just don't think I can believe you.

[โ€“] SimonHoogwerff@feddit.nl 14 points 1 day ago

If I were a blue haired lesbian, I would have an abortion every day. Just to own the MAGA's.

[โ€“] bufalo1973@piefed.social 5 points 23 hours ago

I'm a man and I abort several times every day (when my computers doesn't do what I like).

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago

Your first mistake was trying to convince someone on Facebook of something at all

[โ€“] JackbyDev@programming.dev 1 points 14 hours ago

It's important to realize that convincing someone of something is not immediately evident. They didn't even necessarily know themselves. It's possible she never repeated that "fact" because of what you said.

[โ€“] yourgodlucifer@sh.itjust.works 38 points 1 day ago (4 children)

It worked on me ๐Ÿคทโ€โ™€๏ธ

I used to be rightwing but after learning things about how the world actually works the contradictions were too much and I changed my mind about many things and now I am a filthy socialist.

I have also been able to change a few peoples minds on some things.

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Welcome to the fold comrade๐Ÿค. Currently in the process of trying to deradicalize my family from the right as well

[โ€“] bufalo1973@piefed.social 7 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

Try appealing to their egoism. Don't say that the ones that have nothing must be helped. Tell them that if they lose everything, society will help them. Let's say they have a farm. If a year the crops don't give enough or the animals get sick, they'll be helped by society.

[โ€“] yourgodlucifer@sh.itjust.works 5 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago)

Also point out how social programs often end up costing less in taxes in the long run.

Our healthcare system is the most expensive per person in taxes in the world but we get nothing from it if we switched to universal healthcare we would likely end up saving money in taxes

Use all of the things that conservatives say they value and point out how right wing ideas do not actually uphold these values

Small government

Ice agents rounding everyone up isn't very small government now is it? Its also very expensive

The constitution

Point out how our constitutional rights are being taken away from us right now

Freedom

Is it really freedom to be controlled by corporations?

Meritocracy

Point out how the game is rigged in favor of the rich

Patriotism

Is it really patriotic to be in favor of laws that hurt your fellow Americans?

[โ€“] jaybone@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Just curious, how old were you when you changed your mind?

[โ€“] yourgodlucifer@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

mid 20s

I do think it's possible for older people to change their mind but the longer that they hold on to these ideas the more entrenched they become in their minds and the harder it is for them to change

[โ€“] MutilationWave@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 1 day ago (2 children)

It's also the more they have to lose. If they've built their whole personality and social group around bullshit, they will hang onto the bullshit.

[โ€“] salacious_coaster@infosec.pub 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I think this has a LOT to do with how susceptible a person is to reason that goes against their existing beliefs. I also turned away from the conservative rhetoric in my early twenties. I wasn't really invested in any group, just talking with a few dudes on a gun forum. I didn't have a lot to lose in terms of social investment. But for rural people, going against the right wing narrative could mean being isolated from their whole physical community.

[โ€“] yourgodlucifer@sh.itjust.works 4 points 23 hours ago (2 children)

agreed. some people are completely unwilling to consider other ideas because they don't want to be wrong when presented with anything that conflicts with their world view they will double down instead you can see this with cults that make a doomsday prediction a lot of people will still stay in the cult even after the doomsday prediction has been undeniably proven to be wrong they will find a way to continue to rationalize their beliefs and stay in the cult.

I still feel like there must be a way to get through to these kinds of people after all people do still leave cults even after being in them for many years but I'm not sure how to do that.

[โ€“] bufalo1973@piefed.social 1 points 22 hours ago

I really think some people still think 2012 was the end of the world. But not in a "nuclear war" way but in a slow motion. Just to "be right" about the 2012 bullshit.

[โ€“] salacious_coaster@infosec.pub 1 points 23 hours ago

๐Ÿคท๐Ÿป We're still fundamentally irrational animals. Our powers of reason are limited, and our quirks are easily manipulated.

[โ€“] burntbacon@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 16 hours ago

I think it was when I gave up just about everything that I did do the near 180 on my thinking. It was a culmination though, not just out of the blue.

[โ€“] wabasso@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Hey Iโ€™m interested in you as a datapoint.

Friend of mine suggested that left vs right is fairly ingrained from near-birth, like temperament. Iโ€™ve been thinking about it and personally my leftism certainly does feel like a predisposition, as much as Iโ€™m able to entertain and accept some subset of right wing ideas.

Do you think that you were always left leaning but biased by upbringing, or does it simply feel malleable to you? Could you see yourself swinging back on a balance of evidence?

[โ€“] yourgodlucifer@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I find the idea that your politics are ingrained from birth to be harmful and a similar mindset has been used by the right to demonize the mentally ill and criminals I am a strong believer in rehabilitative justice most people are not completely doomed to be bad people even nazis can change their ways.

in my case I considered myself a rightwing libertarian I always had a bit of an anti-authoritarian mindset but it was misdirected by my upbringing and education. I do think there are a lot of right wing people who don't necessarily like authority you can see this with their skepticism of the government, big pharma, their propensity for conspiracy theories about "elites" but it has been co-opted in a way that does not actually challenge authority.

the right teaches people that instead of rightfully blaming the problems of capitalism on capitalism they find other groups of people for you to blame these problems on and since the education system is so biased a lot of people will just buy into this they don't know any better they have been lied to in some cases their whole life. I blame the education system so much for the rise of the far right.

I did buy into some bigoted ideas I was transphobic, Islamophobic, anti-immigrant learning the actual facts about this learning that I have been lied to about all of these people I changed my mind and it taught me an important lesson about myself I am capable of hate. a lot of people who are bigoted don't see it as hatred because they are not seething with anger, for example with my transphobia I thought that they were mentally ill and needed treatment to "fix" them it didn't come from a place of hatred but pity it is still just as harmful.

my mindset is not the same as it used it has definitely changed can it change again sure but I highly doubt I would ever become right wing again because most of their ideas are thoroughly based off of misinformation and I have spent a lot of time deconstructing that and I also try my best to change people's minds so I am exposed to right wing bullshit on a regular basis I know exactly why these people are wrong and if I don't I research.

knowledge is power

[โ€“] Gloomy@mander.xyz 1 points 7 hours ago

Same. I was an ethical vegetarian once. Then i found out why vegans are vegans and had to accept that there was no such thing as being an ethical vegetarian.

[โ€“] DupaCycki@lemmy.world 18 points 22 hours ago (3 children)

To be fair, 'scientific studies' are increasingly less reliable, so quoting them as 'facts' has less weight. It used to be that any average person could look at an abstract and have a good enough idea to accept what the study found as fact. In 2025 this is less so, because you can't just read the abstract. You also need to read the methodology and ideally who financed the study, since half the studies published are manipulated.

Not that it makes a great difference, but still.

[โ€“] nonfuinoncuro@lemmy.zip 16 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

yeah well I still think OP is right

[โ€“] Jumbie@lemmy.zip 7 points 19 hours ago

You son of a bitch.

[โ€“] pruwybn@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 18 hours ago

Not to mention, it's not like there's a study showing that it's impossible to ever change people's minds. If you want to try to convince someone even though you most likely won't, it doesn't make it pointless.

[โ€“] naticus@lemmy.world 3 points 15 hours ago

That's why you must stick to studies that are peer reviewed. This isn't new, but most people don't know the difference. Studies that are a result of lobbyists paying off doctors generally lose credibility the moment you use that litmus test. It's no guarantee but most of these sham studies are pretty low effort.

[โ€“] StarvingMartist@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

To be fair, this is A pretty complex thing, you can show facts to some people and if it doesn't fit their narrative they will not follow, but there are others who are open. What he should have said was okay there is a trend of this but in my personal experience there are people who do not have this issue as well. And that's not even considering how you approach something, if you come in guns blazing and condescending people will shut you down no matter what facts you have. If you come in understanding and willing to discuss, people are more open to changing their mind. It kind of sounds like op found the two articles didn't actually read them and considered herself the "winner" on this

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Assuming the papers actually dispute the original claim, you'd expect the person to whom OP's referring to not require that approach but accept the facts and admit their wrongness upon viewing the data. The situation just ends up being ironic otherwise.

[โ€“] StarvingMartist@sh.itjust.works 1 points 22 hours ago

I mean yeah, i don't know many people who can just "Read" an entire damn research paper, but usually the abstract is sufficient and taking a look at a few gathered data points. But in my experience, like you said, sometimes the paper just concludes not too strongly one way or another

[โ€“] victorz@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I guess he fit the data of those two sources pretty well then.

There is a nice paradox here. If he conceded, he would've proven himself correct but in the same breath admitted he was not correct, and if he refused to believe those two sources he would've claimed himself correct but proven the sources correct. ๐Ÿ”„

[โ€“] edgemaster72@lemmy.world 4 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 22 hours ago)

To pass through this door, you can ask us only one question. One of us always lies about changing our mind when presented with facts, and the other doesn't.

[โ€“] lugal@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 day ago

Do people deny that there are pipelines and people get radicalized online? You usually change your opinion only a bit each time but over a while, you can end up somewhere else. Don't know how the TWO sources measured it but TWO sources isn't that much. Source: I have none

[โ€“] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 6 points 23 hours ago (4 children)

Would be nice if this weren't posted every single week.

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 11 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

To be fair to me, I haven't seen any other posts on this on the fediverse.

[โ€“] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 3 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

I see it all the time. Not your fault, and apologies if that seemed accusatory. :)

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 4 points 23 hours ago

No worries friend๐Ÿ‘

[โ€“] DupaCycki@lemmy.world 5 points 22 hours ago

Source?

[โ€“] AdolfSchmitler@lemmy.world 2 points 20 hours ago

It's an older meme, but it checks out

[โ€“] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 2 points 19 hours ago (1 children)

complaining about this meme is my favorite thing on the internet

[โ€“] Dasus@lemmy.world 3 points 18 hours ago (1 children)

Complaining about complainers is my favourite thing on the internet

[โ€“] yucandu@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Can I see those studies?

I suspect people might not change their minds overtly but might internally, slowly, over time.

It's way easier to admit you were wrong to yourself in your head than to another human being.

[โ€“] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 8 points 23 hours ago

I don't know the exact papers OOP cited, but here's one that is strongly supported.

Essentially, the researcher proposes that motivation influences reasoning not just by adding bias, but by affecting which cognitive strategies (beliefs, rules, memories) people use. Motivated reasoning is constrained; people are better able to reach their desired conclusion when they can construct plausible justifications for it. They are not completely free to conclude anything they like. So even when motivated to be accurate, bias may persist if individuals donโ€™t have or donโ€™t use more appropriate reasoning strategies.

[โ€“] foo@feddit.uk 3 points 23 hours ago

People seem to be more attached to ideas they had themselves, rather than ones others tell them. I suspect it's more successful to lead them to a conclusion they feel they came to on their own.

[โ€“] DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 4 points 15 hours ago

"Studies show that 9/10 doctors recommend smoking and that it's safe and healthy."

[โ€“] subgenius@sh.itjust.works 2 points 6 hours ago

9 out of 10 RFKs reccomend brain worms.