A place for majestic STEMLORD peacocking, as well as memes about the realities of working in a lab.
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This is a science community. We use the Dawkins definition of meme.
So miniscule it won't poison you but just enough to prevent tooth decay. You really can't have it both ways. Pretending there is any real control over measurement is also ridiculous. Not to mention there is no need to drink fluoride.
You know what does work? Using fluoride topically and getting good dental care.
Those are different mechanisms, why can’t they have different concentrations?
I don't know. I do know fluoride works topically. I also know there is no mechanism in the body to return fluoride to the teeth topically after it is swallowed.
So drinking fluoride is pointless.
So you don't know, but all the data scientists and dentists, who DO know and are subject matter experts, who say it's a good idea are to be ignored, because of your sheer ignorance?
Nobody refutes anything I am saying. I think you are confused.
We've refuted it, scientific testing has refuted it, you're just plugging your ears and refusing to listen because you don't like the answers.
I said fluoride works topically. Do you deny this? Please provide evidence to the contrary.
I said there is no way for the body to return fluoride where it is needed. Swallowing fluoride is pointless and unnecessary at best. At worst it is probably not a good idea to have fluoride in your water if you have kidney disease.
Don't bother actually, we already no you know literally nothing about this topic.
You are spouting assertions about what sounds right while ignoring bodies of scientific evidence contradicting your viewpoint. Just because Lemmy users are unwilling to spend 20-30 minutes digging through arixv to refute you doesn't make you right.
You don't want to go and look up and analyze evidence that floride in the water supply is beneficial, you want to just assert the hypothesis you've formed as likely truth without evidence and research into related work, and I can confidently say this because experts who spend their lives reading papers and writing them on this very topic are qualified to make these assertions.
...This "sounds right" line of thinking has been the bane of civilization for eons. You aren't breaking up some scientific fallacy like the church believing the Earth is the center of the universe, you are perpetuating one.
https://www.cochrane.org/news/water-fluoridation-less-effective-now-past
The latest studies indicate fluoride in the drinking supply has little effect compared compared to fluoride toothpaste. So you once it is available the need for adding fluoride to water goes away. This has been supported by numerous studies comparing countries that do not add fluoride to their water.
I studied this in a 400 level water course at UNI. I got to visit wastewater and water plants and speak with operators. I was surprised to learn the fluoride was not naturally occuring in the water supply as it is advertised on the EPA website.
Then I found an article about a small town in Canada that ran out of fluoride because of a downturn in fertilizer manufacturing. I thought to myself what does fertilizer manufacturing have to do with fluoride.
That is when I discovered the truth that a toxic by-product of fertilizer manufacturing is sold to municipalities to be disposed of in our water supply. It is not pharmeucutical fluoride because that would cost too much. Oh and it is contaminated with nasty stuff like heavy metals.
I then did a bunch of research comparing rates of tooth decay in different areas of the world. It really did not appear to make a difference but actual dental care and fluoride toothpaste did.
My presentation was about a hour and a half where I presented all my research. I got an A on it and everyone was very impressed with what I discovered.
But sure tell me about my own journey when you literally have no fucking clue what you are talking about about.
Ah yes, the most rigorous of scientific studies- claiming you did a paper in school! You got an A, and then everybody clapped!
My man, in less than two hours you've literally went from claiming you don't know how fluoride works on teeth to claiming you did rigorous research on it in uni.
At least keep your bullshit lies straight for more than two hours.
Your are so funny I forgot to laugh. You are definitely Darwin award material.
The question to me is - do we even have to fluoridate water and is this really the best approach?
For example, most European countries do not commonly use fluoride in their water supply, and everyone's just fine! No extra cavities, no special health risks. People commonly drink tap water and do not care about potential for any adverse effects, because it's just that - clean water. And for any teeth-related issues, you already have your toothpaste providing more than enough fluorine.
Water fluoridation reaches over 13 million Europeans through programs in England, Ireland, Poland, Serbia and Spain
Children in deprived areas benefit most from water fluoridation according to 2018 English health agency report
Over 70 million Europeans receive fluoridated salt through programs in Austria, France, Germany, Switzerland and other countries. Salt fluoridation is recommended when water fluoridation is not feasible
European Academy of Pediatric Dentistry endorses water fluoridation as "core component of oral health policy"
Fluoridated milk programs have operated in Bulgaria, England, Hungary, Russia and Scotland
Several European countries provide free or subsidized fluoride treatments through national healthcare:
Scandinavian schools offer fluoride varnish, tablets and rinse programs
Some regions in Europe have naturally fluoridated water, such as parts of Italy. Italian health officials support water fluoridation but don't implement additional programs due to naturally optimal fluoride levels in some areas
Evidence shows that water fluoridation prevents tooth decay by providing frequent and consistent contact with low levels of fluoride, ultimately reducing tooth decay by about 25% in children and adults.
evidence shows that schoolchildren living in communities where water is fluoridated have, on average, 2.25 fewer decayed teeth compared to similar children not living in fluoridated communities.
A study to compare costs associated with community water fluoridation with treatment savings achieved through reduced tooth decay, which included 172 public water systems, each serving populations of 1,000 individuals or more, found that 1 year of exposure to fluoridated water yielded an average savings of $60 per person when the lifetime costs of maintaining a restoration were included.
Analyses of Medicaid claims data in 3 other states (Louisiana, New York, and Texas), have also found that children living in fluoridated communities have lower caries related treatment costs than do similar children living in non-fluoridated communities; the difference in annual per child treatment costs ranged from $28 to $67.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9544072/
community water fluoridation continues to decrease cavities by 25% at the population level.
Even with fluoridated products such as toothpaste and mouth rinses, this public health practice can reduce an additional 25% of tooth decay in children and adults
In 1945, Grand Rapids, Michigan became the first U.S. city to fluoridate its public water supply. Five years later, Grand Rapids schoolchildren were found to have significantly fewer cavities than children from the control community of Muskegon, and additional water districts, including Muskegon began fluoridating and seeing similar results
Studies have shown that populations from lower socioeconomic groups within fluoridated communities have less tooth decay when compared to peers in nonfluoridated communities
The cost of a lifetime of water fluoridation for one person is less than the cost of one filling
More info: https://www.ada.org/resources/community-initiatives/fluoride-in-water
For what’s it worth, in my country (Netherlands), we don’t add fluoride to our tap water anymore since the early 70s. We just have it in our toothpaste (though you can also get fluoride free toothpaste for those who don’t want it).
Sure there’s still traces of fluoride in our water, as it appears in nature. But it’s not artificially added by our water companies.
Most places that do add it to the water supply match the levels of places where flouride occurs naturally
My thing is this...
fluoridation has nothing to with any teeth-related issues, it was all about the US industry having a way to dispose of fluoride, a byproduct of many industrial activities. You can't just dump fluoride on a river as it has several adverse side-effects, but it you can convince everyone it is good for their health then it's okay to dump it on the water supply.
lmao. rofl even. Fluoride is incredibly expensive AND useful, if you run an industry you wanna make sure you absolutely recover it from byproducts and reuse it, not to mention that with how low the levels in tap water are, it wouldn't be even a good way of disposing a lot of it
Is this what you do? Just spread as many lies a possible on the internet?