this post was submitted on 29 Jul 2025
115 points (98.3% liked)

Ask Lemmy

33713 readers
1154 users here now

A Fediverse community for open-ended, thought provoking questions


Rules: (interactive)


1) Be nice and; have funDoxxing, trolling, sealioning, racism, and toxicity are not welcomed in AskLemmy. Remember what your mother said: if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. In addition, the site-wide Lemmy.world terms of service also apply here. Please familiarize yourself with them


2) All posts must end with a '?'This is sort of like Jeopardy. Please phrase all post titles in the form of a proper question ending with ?


3) No spamPlease do not flood the community with nonsense. Actual suspected spammers will be banned on site. No astroturfing.


4) NSFW is okay, within reasonJust remember to tag posts with either a content warning or a [NSFW] tag. Overtly sexual posts are not allowed, please direct them to either !asklemmyafterdark@lemmy.world or !asklemmynsfw@lemmynsfw.com. NSFW comments should be restricted to posts tagged [NSFW].


5) This is not a support community.
It is not a place for 'how do I?', type questions. If you have any questions regarding the site itself or would like to report a community, please direct them to Lemmy.world Support or email info@lemmy.world. For other questions check our partnered communities list, or use the search function.


6) No US Politics.
Please don't post about current US Politics. If you need to do this, try !politicaldiscussion@lemmy.world or !askusa@discuss.online


Reminder: The terms of service apply here too.

Partnered Communities:

Tech Support

No Stupid Questions

You Should Know

Reddit

Jokes

Ask Ouija


Logo design credit goes to: tubbadu


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

To set the stage: I've heard the recent news about layoffs with Intel. Before that I read from their new CEO "On training, I think it is too late for us". Lastly there has been some offhand comments (from LTT) that they're preparing to sell the company.

Yet while I have no doubt that they are behind; their revenue is about 55 billion since 2023, down from the high of 78-80ish Billion during the pandemic, but about the same as the plateau leading up to the pandemic 2015-2019.

Maybe i'm naive about the way businesses work; but if your still profitable, and you know you need to "catch up" why lay off people and close sites? Maybe that works for a consumer goods company; if your overhead is too high and your not making a profit: slim down.

However for a company where RND is really where the value is, like Intel, it just doesn't seem to make sense; your not going to get better designs and processes by reducing your experienced staff and letting them go work for the competition. Maybe some restructuring, (in the engineering sense not the euphemism for layoffs).

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[โ€“] GamingChairModel@lemmy.world 17 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Intel is best thought of as two businesses, where their historical dominance in one (actually fabricating semiconductors) protected their dominance in another (designing logic chips), despite not actually being the best at that.

Intel's fabs represented the cutting edge in semiconductor manufacturing, and their superiority in that business almost killed AMD, who just couldn't keep up. Eventually, AMD decided they wouldn't try to keep up with cutting edge semiconductor manufacturing, and spun off their fabs as an independent company called Global Foundries in 2009.

But Intel hit a wall in progressing in semiconductor manufacturing, and made very slow progress with a new type of transistor known as a finFET, with lots of roadblocks and challenges. The biggest delays came around Intel's 10nm process, where they never got yields quite to where they should have been, while other foundries like Samsung and TSMC passed them up. And so their actual CPU business suffered because AMD, now a fabless chip designer, could go all in on TSMC's more advanced processes. Plus because they were fabless, they pioneered advanced packaging for "chiplet" designs where different pieces of silicon could be connected in a way that they acted like a single chip, but where the different components could be small enough that imperfections wouldn't hurt yield as badly, and where they could mix and match the cheap processes and the expensive processes to the part of the "chip" that actually needed the performance and precision.

Meanwhile, Apple was competing with Qualcomm and Samsung in the mobile System on a Chip (SoC) systems for phones, and developed its own silicon expertise. Eventually, they were able to scale up performance (with TSMC's help) to make a competitive laptop chip based on the principles of their mobile chip design (and then eventually desktop chips). That allowed them to stop buying Intel chips, and switch to their own designs, manufactured by TSMC. Qualcomm is also attempting to get into the laptop/small PC market by scaling up their mobile chip designs, also manufactured by TSMC.

Intel can get things right if it catches up with or surpasses TSMC in the next paradigm of semiconductor manufacturing. The transistors are changing from finFET (where TSMC has utter dominance) to GAAFET (where Intel, TSMC, and Samsung are all jockeying for position), and are trying out backside power (where the transistor gates are powered from underneath rather than from the cluttered top side). Intel has basically gone all in on their 18A process, and in a sense it's a bit of a clean slate in their competition with TSMC (and to a lesser degree, Samsung, and a new company out of Japan named Rapidus), and possibly even with Chinese companies like SMIC.

But there are negative external signs. Intel acknowledged that they don't have a lot of outside customers signing up for foundry services, so they're not exactly poaching any clients from TSMC. And if that's happening while TSMC is making absurd profits, that must mean that those potential clients who have seen Intel's tech under NDA might see that Intel is falling further behind from TSMC. At that point, Intel will struggle to compete on logic chips (CPUs against AMD and Apple and maybe Qualcomm, discrete GPUs against AMD and NVIDIA), if they're all just paying TSMC to make the chips for them.

So I don't think all of their layoffs make a ton of sense, but understand that they're really trying to retake the lead on fabrication, with everything else a lesser priority.

Thank you for this excellent summary!