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Man, if the holocaust happened today, turns out most people would actually be on team holocaust. Wait, that's exactly whats happening...
I don't think it's most people. Opinions outside of Israel have largely shifted against it even in the US. Politicians often misrepresent their constituents on this one. At least that's what it looks like in some polls I've seen.
They're attempting to astroturf a Holocaust. People aren't on board but the rich goombas are.
Emphasis on "rich" here. History has shown that genocide is always followed by claiming and then divvying up the resources once held by the displaced/dead. That's always a rich-man's game.
A line from Rage Against the Machine's "Darkness"
Like this
So you're saying the favor should be returned- reciprocated, even.
I like that idea.
Good thing Luigi's mansion is common man's game.
Not in Congress. Not on Wall Street. No where the power congeals. We're hitting the end-stage of the War on Terror. Western states are not going to be happy until the entire Muslim world is cowed or exterminated.
Of course, but the disconnect growing on this coincides with the disconnect on other important issues and things are eventually coming to a head.
People who vote for nazis/murderers are complicit. Politicians are elected, so the “constituents” do not get to wash the blood from their hands. They are just as guilty.
Yeah, the debates seems to be mostly people questioning if it is war crimes or genocide, different experts and different organizations have different conclusions, although it seems more conclusions are shifting towards genocide.
"even the US" bro they have been feeding their people milk and cheese tobacco and lies for decades because it's how you get rich, it's literally a country where you can be a politician, decide to give you money, there's nothing over there that has ever represented what actual people want for 50 years, they're having a civil class war and the rich won long ago, megacorps decide what the people want
I see you're also a Climate Town enjoyer. 😄
If there was only one person on earth I could choose to marry it would be that guy
The Israeli government doesn't represent everyone who follows the Jewish faith. Jewish practitioners (especially abroad) shouldn't be assumed to be complicit unless they claim or are shown to be.
That may be; I know nothing. But somebody just posted something like “Jews of lemmy, how is your family on Israel / Gaza?” And most said their families were all very pro Israeli government / Zionist. It sounded a lot like most were complicit.
Here it is, and it is a bit better than when I saw it first, but still…
If you don't think Israel's propaganda campaign extends to lemmy I've got a bridge to sell you.
What? I’m not saying anything like that. But… if you’re offering, I wouldn’t mind checking out that bridge.
Impressive research effort!
Who said that the government represent all jews? Governments set up country policies. When we say israel of course we mean israeli governments Israel since it's creation policies was to oppress, steal land kill and rape palestinians.
The fact that you choose tocsay this bs comment instead of those activists risk to die from israel terrorism show how tou don't care about those people and the activists
Said government says it, and jewish non-Israelis are barely heard disputing that. I don't know if it's them or the media not giving them equal voice, but one or the other is essentially promoting Netanyahu as spokesperson for everything jewish.
then educate yourself and stop speculating
No one implied otherwise here, and speaking of here, you're rather preaching to the choir, don't you think?
That is completely true and also unlikely to matter.
I was born 3 decades after the end of WWII. By that point Germany and Austria had gone through great lengths to repudiate the policies of the Nazis. They had paid massive reparations. They had issued numerous official and unofficial apologies. The monuments of the Nazis were torn down in favor of memorials for their victims. That didn't stop other kids from calling me a Nazi as soon as they found out I spoke German. To this day people are comfortable making Nazi jokes about random Germans (see Oliver Zeidler).
Similarly, we have evidence that the vast majority of sexual assaults are committed by a small number of repeat offenders. That doesn't stop the repeated mantra of, "Not all men but always a man."
Many people, particularly in Asia, are offended that the Nazis turned the Swastika into a symbol of hatred. Most people are aware that the Nazis stole the symbol but you really can't wear one without risking a fight, even if you have the little dots in it.
It doesn't matter if they should or shouldn't be assumed to be complicit; they will. People around the world will see the Star of David as a symbol of death and destruction for generations.
Indeed, while Israel is indeed a Jewish country, it does not represent all Jews, nor do all Jews agree with the way the Israeli behave. Condemning Israel is justified, hating all Jews because of Israel is not.
Yeah, no shit.
It is a holocaust, essentially.
Most people in the west you mean. Most people in the world are very much against Israel and it's genocide. I think we forget this.
If you live in the west you can feel alone in caring about the suffering. You just feel alone in the west.
Not most people, most bots
Then why are all the governments collectively punishing people for speaking out? I'm sure there is some astroturfing, but I know a number of people who have some weird opinions on this bcz they get their news from conservative sources.
I think the only bad thing about the Holocaust was that Germany did it. Germany threatened established colonial powers. They threatened international order. Therefore the Holocaust is a terrible thing and Germany had to be stopped.
When the good guys do a Holocaust it's not bad anymore.
Edit: I mean as far as most people use it.
Yeah. People misunderstand your comment's viewpoint, but it's accurate.
The allies have retconned their WWII history as brave defenders of modern society and freedom when in reality they did not intervene for anyone's sake but their own. Least of all the Jews'. Tons of advocates for eugenics and phrenology along vocal fascists like Henry Ford in the US, imperialist ambitions towards non-western countries, the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact...
You actually think that? Please tell me it's just poorly phrased.
I'm sure he only means it as "this is the shitty way the world actually works". Not that he personally believes it himself.
The fact that you’re stopping to read what the person said and form a charitable interpretation of it instead of just leaping down their throat while smashing your phone / keyboard with rage is commendable.
Ignoring the actual content / intended meaning of what they said the moment THIS right here disappears from Lenny is the moment it’s dead.
I mean, if they actually think the holocaust was hunky dory then fuck them, but I agree it’s probably just poorly phrased.
If that were the case I'd hope they would try to be clearer.
The "@mhague@lemmy.world is a giant asshole" reading is much, much easier than the "@mhague@lemmy.world thinks the world sucks" reading, for me at least. The second reading takes some mental gymnastics for me.
Hoping you're right, but not convinced. Also giving a lot of side-eye.
i don’t agree with the original comment bc it is pessimistic reductionism but i think you and the people dogging on it severely lack media literacy and critical thinking skills, as kindly as that can be stated.
in what way is the former reading more likely than the latter??
you need to make far more assumptions about the original comment and commenter to come to the conclusion that he made the comment out of some weird bigoted malice than to just accept the obvious reading of it being a commentary on global society’s attitudes towards various genocides.
jesus fucking christ i see this shit all over the internet and it is why our society is collapsing. just droves of people behaving and thinking in ways that would fucking abhor a literature teacher from even just a decade ago.
Hard agree. And many folk forget, English is not everyone's first language.
It's janky phrasing, but after a reread, it makes sense.
I'm personally scared for what the future holds, we are living in a post-Enlightenment society.
At the risk of sounding a little chud-y... we are tasked with the same challenge people like Newton or Spinoza dealt with in life; we need to rebuild meaning, reason, and thought from first principles in a way that is amicable to the modern order.
People, like those that we're seeing in action here, probably think Modest Proposal is actually encouraging the audience to eat children. It's a serious problem.
When someone says "I think the only bad thing about the Holocaust was that Germany did it" they need to do a fair amount of work to clarify that they do not mean that literally. Otherwise, I will be inclined to take them at their word.
of course he means it literally?
that’s why i think, as i said, his comment is reductionist. the key word is
he’s just trying to draw an edgy hyperbolic narrative that the world only cares about the Holocaust in particular not because it is a genocide but because it threatened the international status quo. he’s wrong, but he’s not a nazi, at least as far as i can tell from his singular comment. i won’t come up to bat for the original commenter, he very well could be a bigot or a nazi. i don’t have enough context to know as a reader. his use of leftist diction and the way he wields it is a pretty strong indicator that this was his intended thesis, on top of obvious contextual clues.
man fuck idek what else to say. your response here is purely reactionary, you aren’t even saying anything other than reaffirming things you’ve already said.
If you do a holocaust then you’re not one of the good guys. It’s pretty simple.
They're clearly not speaking from their own perspective.