X11 was the only standard prior to Wayland.
GNOME is dropping X11 in a short time.
KDE's telemetry even five months ago showed 80+% of (that portion of) their userbase uses Wayland, and they plan to drop X11 once they have a concrete set of problems worked out.
Hyprland and Sway run Wayland exclusively.
Cinnamon, MATE, and Xfce are working on Wayland sessions. Cinnamon's is there but, I think, still experimental.
Budgie is working to go Wayland-only.
There's no sign that Wayland will stop improving from a state that's arguably already much better than X11.
X11's actual maintainers barely want anything to do with it beyond bug fixes, and the only person who wants to "innovate" it via a fork is a bigot and a fucking moron who doesn't know things you learn in CS 101.
X11's maintainers are majorly involved in developing Wayland and have been since the start. This is their idea.

It seems like it went from "Situation: there is one standard" to "Situation: there are two standards developed by largely the same people with one set to replace the other", and then soon: "Situation: there is one standard and one translation layer kept around for a decade or so for compatibility."

Not every single time someone tries to make things better is this xkcd relevant; this had nothing to do with unifying standards and everything to do with superseding one.

[–] FilthyShrooms@lemmy.world 7 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Huh neat. I kinda just assumed "wheel11" had 10 other versions and didnt realize it was an analogy for something irl

[–] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 15 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

You are actually correct that Wheel11 had 10 other versions. It just happens that those 10 other versions were released before September 1987.

[–] Gutek8134@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago (2 children)

> Pretty much everything uses wayland now

> nVidia drivers don't work on Wayland

> ANGER

And that's why I'm getting AMD when I'll be ~~modernizing~~ replacing my setup

[–] FauxLiving@lemmy.world 4 points 2 days ago (1 children)

> nVidia drivers don’t work on Wayland

What?

I'm using Wayland with nvidia-open drivers and I don't have a problem even using proton via Wayland for HDR.

[–] Gutek8134@lemmy.world 1 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

I'm using the proprietary ones on Bazzite and they don't let me change my refresh rate - fortunately it only went from 75Hz to 60.

When I looked up the issue, the only reason I could find is that the drivers have issues with Wayland.

[–] FauxLiving@lemmy.world 1 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

Ah.

I've used a few distros that locked specific patch levels and that's just one of the kinds of issues you deal with. Sometimes that version has a bug and you have to wait for the next major release to get the update.

I'm using a rolling release distro, which comes with a different set of problems. But, I have the latest drivers and Wayland updates and have not encountered any significant issues using high refresh rate, VRR, HDR even while gaming.

It's also possible that Bazzite is using gamescope which does have significant issues with NVIDIA, even still. But the newest versions of Proton support using Wayland directly (instead of XWayland), so it's possible to avoid using gamescope entirely without losing access to display features.

[–] boringbisexual@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 day ago

Obligatory "it works for me". I only had one issue with one game on Wayland. Some nvidia driver update fixed that a few months ago.

[–] popcornpizza@lemmy.blahaj.zone 14 points 3 days ago (3 children)

"And duck the users for wanting to know in their own Linux systems which windows are opened, whether the mouse is there, send input signals to them, etc. No, Wheeland is not going to have any of those, we'll force the gazillion DEs to recreate that part of the wheel."

[–] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 34 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

If "the wheel" is achieved by making literally every application you run a keylogger, I'm very cool with Wayland "reinventing the wheel". X11's handling of user input is a fucking embarrassment.

Besides just the Steam Deck and Proton, a big reason people are finally sticking around on Linux is because using X11 feels exactly like what it is: a cobbled-together piece of archaic shit that needs to be left behind.

Wayland by contrast feels fantastic to run, and on my GTX 1070 with proprietary drivers, the only current issue I have with it is how Firefox picture-in-picture popouts don't stay on top by default.

[+] popcornpizza@lemmy.blahaj.zone -13 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yeah well, I thought Linux was all about controlling one's own OS? Or are we now Apple and Microsoft?

Besides, the "keylogger" is pretty much essential for mouse gestures. But now we don't care about accessibility, I guess.

[–] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 23 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

Has anyone so far stopped you from using your outmoded tangle of garbage? Or do you just not like that major desktop environments are switching to more sensible defaults?

If you're worried about GNOME 50 dropping X11 in the future... okay? Nobody's obliged to maintain your shit. Linux is all about choice, and it's their choice not to spend untold thousands of hours working to keep X11 usable, just like it's your choice to change your Linux to something that does still use it. Switch to any one of the other desktop environments; see if the Wayland Illuminati or whatever gives a shit.

[–] hddsx@lemmy.ca 6 points 3 days ago

Hey we are penguins not ducks

[–] TabbsTheBat@pawb.social 5 points 3 days ago

'tis the wheeland experience :3. At least we can have monitors with different refresh rates tho

As is we do kinda have 2 standards, both equally bad, and you just have to pick your poison